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Post by Warwick on Jul 11, 2012 5:50:42 GMT
I thought I'd better repost this somewhere more appropriate, instead of where it started ... roverp5.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=sale31&thread=6205&page=2It's funny to see that there's Citroens and Peugeots down under. Cyf, Your French automotive knowledge clearly needs some attention. The first car to circumnavigate Australia was a 1923 Citroen 5CV in 1925. The second car to do it was a Citroen B-type in 1926. The first REDeX around Australia reliability trial in 1953 was won by a Peugeot 203. The world's largest French car forum is Aussiefrogs www.aussiefrogs.comCitroens have been assembled in Melbourne. Renault had a factory building Renaults and Peugeots in Melbourne. When Renault Australia shut down in the mid 1980s, assembly of the 505 (under licence) shifted to the Jaguar Rover Australia (JRA) plant in Sydney. JRA was what remained of Leyland Australia after a management buy-out after its collapse in the 1970s when the P76 was being built. During the 1980s I was able to buy my Range Rover and Peugeot parts from the same supplier. Vince, 1968 you say! I sat in that 404 and it was then that Dad decided to buy one instead of the ID19. You did a good job. Small world.
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Post by Warwick on Jul 11, 2012 6:34:52 GMT
And just to keep it balanced.And it's also where I saw my first P5B. Never thought I'd own one. I also never imagined myself this old.And then 1970, when my car was built. It was built 10 days after the end of the show and set sail for Regent Motors a month later.
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Post by cyf on Jul 11, 2012 20:03:42 GMT
Thank you for the highlights Warwick. I knew of course that the Citroen boys went all around the planet but i didn't know that the French manufacturers were so well represented in Australia. I thought it was more English, American and Japanese cars I like the story of you and enigmas and the 404 at the '68 motor show.
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Post by enigmas on Jul 11, 2012 22:55:58 GMT
That's amazing stuff Warwick. I was 16 in 1968. So long ago. I was also taken to a factory where Renault Gordini's were being prepared and we were shown a film of one being race demonstrated and at a later date was given a ride in one. These were very quick and sophisticated little cars considering what was available at the time. Vince
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Post by Warwick on Jul 12, 2012 4:28:07 GMT
Thank you for the highlights Warwick. I knew of course that the Citroen boys went all around the planet but i didn't know that the French manufacturers were so well represented in Australia. I thought it was more English, American and Japanese cars I like the story of you and enigmas and the 404 at the '68 motor show. Cyf, These weren't factory expeditions a la the Kegresse Sahara crossing. They were just private adventurers in private cars. Only 3 manufacturers left now - GM-Holden, Ford and Toyota and they are finding it hard as exports have fallen due to the strength of our currency. In the very early days of motoring, the cars came from everywhere, including our own home-grown cars. Once we got to the '30s and '40s, we probably got more British and American cars. But with a very small population and a long way between cities and towns, many of the roads outside the main centres were poor. Due to the extremes in driving conditions between here and the UK, as their cars developed, many became less suited to our conditions. Many were too small or under powered, or not suited to rough roads. The bigger, stronger, more powerful British cars were the expensive ones. The Americans on the other hand had similar conditions to ours outside of their cities. They made larger more powerful cars. By the '50s and '60s, the average American car had become too big for our cities and their suspension had become less suited to anything but smooth bitumen. The cars built here still tend to be smaller versions of American cars but with British and European thinking with regard to suspension and handling. This is just my own overly simplistic summary of the situation based on recollection. However in the midst of all this, the French cars of the '50s, '60s and '70s seemed to be ideally suited to our conditions with a combination of strength, lightness, durability, comfort, and ride quality. Perhaps this was as a result of France's big involvement in Africa. Or perhaps you had poor rural roads then too. Other cars which fitted this situation were the air-cooled VWs. There were of course British cars which could handle those conditions too. The P6 is a good example - but they tended to be expensive. The Japanese didn't really have much to offer until the late '60s, but they were very quick to adapt and evolve. The 404 is probably the car that has impressed me more than any other. Lightweight, extremely tough, extremely comfortable, roomy, nibble, quick from point to point, and very very durable. Nothing special on paper. But the whole machine is very much greater than the sum of its parts. Those who haven't driven one can't understand. I wish I still had mine. That's amazing stuff Warwick. I was 16 in 1968. So long ago. I was also taken to a factory where Renault Gordini's were being prepared and we were shown a film of one being race demonstrated and at a later date was given a ride in one. These were very quick and sophisticated little cars considering what was available at the time. Vince Vince, I remember when the Monaro made its racing debut at Sandown in 1968 prior to Bathurst. I was 18. It dominated in the straights but got left for dead in the corners by the R10 Gordini.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2012 9:16:29 GMT
Great stuff Warwick have read with interest. Also reminded me of French cars on rough roads in the middle of France with high temperatures in the summers of my relative youth. 2CV's full of pigs across bumpy fields! Sounds like the ideal car for OZ!
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Post by Warwick on Jul 12, 2012 9:51:20 GMT
Peter,
When I say that these cars were ideally suited to our conditions, I'm not suggesting that they were popular. To those with no experience of them and those who didn't read widely about cars, they were just funny little French cars. It was always interesting to offer a ride or drive to a typical Holden or Ford driver of the day, and see their surprise.
In the '70s and '80s, there was the same sort of common ignorance of the Range Rover's abilities by your average Landcruiser or Nissan Patrol driver.
Ah, those were the days. I must be getting old.
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Post by Warwick on Jul 12, 2012 9:57:55 GMT
Here's a challenge.
Does anyone know the identity of the car pictured on the cover of the 1968 catalogue? i.e. The first photo in this thread, with the tag hanging from the door handle.
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Post by bebopdeluxe on Jul 23, 2012 7:04:06 GMT
CITROËN: AMI 6 BERLINE
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Post by Warwick on Jul 23, 2012 7:37:12 GMT
I've no idea Glenn. I assume it would be a 1968 model that was on display at that show.
I have no idea why, but the Bertone styled Mazda 1500 popped into mind, but on checking, it bears no resemblence.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2012 8:26:21 GMT
I gave up. I was convinced it was a Cortina for some reason. Absolutely convinced. I just knew I was right. But I wasn't. Then I tried to check the Melbourne Motor Show site but there were just too many photos and they took so long to load.
So perhaps Glenn is right? But now Warwick says he doesn't know either...This is indeed a challenge. A question with no answer.
Perhaps Cyf can confirm that Glenn has won? Or given the Bertone influence do we need an Italian member to adjudicate? Is it the PTO handle on a Ferguson 135? The story continues...
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Post by bebopdeluxe on Jul 23, 2012 8:37:15 GMT
What do I win, what do I win ........Although I have changed my mind ;D
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Post by Warwick on Jul 23, 2012 11:43:06 GMT
Come on Vince! What is it? You were there.
I just had a flash of Valiant then ... but it isn't that either.
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Post by enigmas on Jul 23, 2012 22:29:25 GMT
I have no idea Warwick? But I'll scour the local streets for a match. ~ Vince
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Post by Warwick on Jul 25, 2012 3:22:43 GMT
I just had a browse through the catalogue Vince, in the hope that I might match it with a photo - but no such luck. However, I did find this. This probably means that it isn't necessarily a car that was on display that year. But if we could track down Andrew Clarke, we could ask him. I still reckon it looks familiar and I should know it. According to the RBA's on-line inflation calculator, that $100 would be $1,085 now.
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Post by stever on Aug 3, 2012 9:51:08 GMT
Here's a challenge. Does anyone know the identity of the car pictured on the cover of the 1968 catalogue? i.e. The first photo in this thread, with the tag hanging from the door handle. Hi Warwick, I think I know which car this is. I'm guessing it's an XM Falcon. The stainless trim looks the same, and the key lock would be hiding behind the tag. The XM is a '64 model I know but maybe it didn't matter that all much. Now back to the Rovers . I have a MK 3 Coupe that I'll take some more photos of and post them up as soon as I can clear a space in front of the shed. I hope to do that this weekend. Regards Steve.
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Post by Warwick on Aug 3, 2012 13:31:53 GMT
Thanks Steve, As soon as I read your post, I knew you were right. Yes, let's see those photos of your P5 please.
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