Guus
Rover Fanatic
Posts: 196
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Post by Guus on May 29, 2009 15:53:42 GMT
The mistake I made:Left the ignition switch on all night while the battery was charging. What happened first:The electric petrol pump broke down, I replaced it with a new one. Then what?After turning the ignition switch no current came to the pump. Only if I connected the pump to the upper fuse, it started pumping. And?The car fired up neatly, but went dead immediately because the throttle didn't seem to work anymore! I checked all connections, but nothing seemed wrong... That's all?No, unfortunaltely... The second time I tried to turn the ignition switch, it completely desintegrated! two rings fell out, a spring and the plate with all te connections. Questions:1. What might be wrong with the throttle? Or might it be the coil and distributor not getting any current? I doubted that, since it would fire up neatly. The coil was rather warm though, the day after... 2. Can I fix the ignition switch or should I renew it. I can't seem to find a drawing of it in Haynes... Thnks!
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Post by Kev on May 29, 2009 16:19:32 GMT
I can't believe the throttle does not work just because you left the ignition on I would rebuild the ignition switch,re wire it all back to the fuse box,then test the coil,then see what's what. Coil may be knackered now or the problem lies with the switch. Good Luck,and you won't do that again,will you? Big Kev.
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Guus
Rover Fanatic
Posts: 196
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Post by Guus on May 29, 2009 16:53:36 GMT
Thanks Kev, Do you perhaps have a schedule or drawing of the ignition-switch?
Do you think the coil is broken, although the car fires up?
And, no, thought leaving the ignition-switch on would be more fun... so won't do that again..
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Post by Phil Nottingham on May 29, 2009 17:03:30 GMT
What sort of strater switch/coil set do you have? Also is engine/btatery earth good and rear end "chassis" uncorroded?
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Guus
Rover Fanatic
Posts: 196
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Post by Guus on May 29, 2009 18:10:26 GMT
Hello Phil, Neither the starter switch nor the coil show any brand. There is a number on the starter swith: 39175A 2369.
And on the coil there seems to be scratched on '5 M'.
Does that make any sense to you?
Thanks.
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Post by Phil Nottingham on May 29, 2009 18:38:20 GMT
No I meant standard or theif proof?
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Post by Colin McA on May 29, 2009 18:56:16 GMT
Replace the switch if it is damaged.
P5 ones are available but you can do as I have and fitted a 3 position landrover item.
Colin
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Guus
Rover Fanatic
Posts: 196
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Post by Guus on May 29, 2009 19:20:25 GMT
I think it is a standard set (starter and coil),
Colin, I suppose you'll have to change the keys as well when changing the switch?
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Post by Phil Nottingham on May 29, 2009 21:24:37 GMT
The locking barrel is separate fron the actual switch so can be easily removed and refitted to the new switch by inserting a 3/16th drill into the hole in the side of the swith and pressing down to release the locking pin. New Lucas switches are available from Wadhams/Ebay/Holdens approx £10 unless it is the column when only s/h are available so it is better to convert to console for reliability If the points were closed when leaving the ignition on the coil will be ruined most likely through overheating. It probably got very hot! Use a standard Lucas Sports coil if non-ballasted or bypass the ballast wire/ballast coil Do you mean it will not rev? If so it is likley to be coil/condensor/points damage or somehow because of poor engine earth the throttle cable has overheated and siezed. Likley to be the coil though May have also damaged the 3AW or 4TR or alternator diodes too
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Post by enigmas on May 31, 2009 11:35:59 GMT
Guus, it's a good idea to fit an 'Isolation Switch' to the positive battery terminal when you decide to do anything electrical. These are available at most general autoparts suppliers.
Whenever I charge the battery, alter wiring, add switchgear, complete electrical repairs or MIG weld on my vehicle, its a very quick method to isolate the battery (and anything else electrical that maybe drawing residual current... radio and CD memory).
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Post by Paul - P5B Coupe on Jun 1, 2009 7:44:19 GMT
Vince - after removing my battery box, I find it is not much more work to remove the neg battery lead. But with your knowledge of things P5 I imagine you have probably fitted an in-line switch within easy reach - or have you used the screw-out type isolator on the battery terminal ? I considered a screw-out isolator but presumed it would interfere with the battery box so didn't proceed. Would you provide some detail as to what type of switch you installed ?
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Post by johnwp5bcoupe on Jun 1, 2009 8:11:16 GMT
There are several types you can fit one fits on the battery terminal with a small current by pass fuse to keep the clock going if some one tries to start the car they obviously can't with the switch open but it will blow the small fuse if you forget. The other thing about battery chargers some are very crude and depending on battery condition ie loading the voltage can be horrendously high so if you put 20v plus! which I have seen during my working years things will "break down" I have now with the Carcoon a battery conditioner which saves all the grief during off road times any other time I use a PSU which I set the voltage and limit the current quick charging is not always a good thing
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Post by enigmas on Jun 1, 2009 11:04:55 GMT
Paul, I fitted a screw-out type isolator as you've mentioned. It's fitted on the terminal within the battery box. My V8 Magnette has a key type isolator (large red plastic key also fitted in the boot) within easy reach. The key is left in place at all times. ~ Vince
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Guus
Rover Fanatic
Posts: 196
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Post by Guus on Jun 1, 2009 20:49:38 GMT
Thanks all for the replies gentlemen!
Enigmas, you mentioned Piranha Electrinic Ignitions in a previous topic. I am considering a new ignition myself. Do you have experience with 123ignition too? There is a huge difference in price (66 GBP for Piranha and 450 EUR for 123ignition).
Thanks!
Regards, guus
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Post by Paul - P5B Coupe on Jun 2, 2009 0:58:35 GMT
Thanks Vince - now that I know it fits, I'll install a screw out isolator.
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Post by eisdielenbiker on Jun 2, 2009 7:37:32 GMT
Hello Guus, do you really think that a price of 450 EUR is actual ? The version for the early V8 in our Rovers is even over 500 EUR. Where would you source yours. Once I was considering it too, although having a luminition which is very fine and free of problems. I had a 123 in my MGB it cured a nasty problem there. Before fitting the car ran 20 miles and stalled. And the idle could not be set anywhere under 1000 rpm. Both problems where cured with 123ignition. Possibly the old vacuum or advance unit were faulty. Mark
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Post by enigmas on Jun 2, 2009 12:47:13 GMT
Guus, I've used the Pirhana Ignition Kit for the last 15 years that I can recall. I've fitted it to my RoverP5 and my daughter's 71 Valiant Coupe. I've seen quite a few on P6s. Do not use a so-called sports coil just a standard 12 volt unballasted coil and a good set of leads. A sports type coil tends to overload the power transistor (darlington) after a short period of time no matter what the literature states. How do I know this? (You don't have to be Albert Einstein). Power transistors are easily replaced if you can use a soldering iron.
Personally I think they are good value and would recommend one to you. Your EURO price for the 123 is scary!
Mark the idle was bad on the MGB most likely because the distributor bushes were shot (points ignition) and the variation in firing between cyl to cyl could have easily varied 6 to 8 degrees...which is the case with most (worn) V8 points distributors.
The Pirhana because it uses a slotted disc to pinpoint the firing sequences accurately will produce a smooth idle at a fraction of the cost and complexity.
~ Vince
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Post by Phil Nottingham on Jun 2, 2009 15:50:20 GMT
I would never recommend Lumenition - I have 2 units fail leading to breakdown/recovery. I have gone back to points it more reliable
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2009 17:25:20 GMT
That's bad luck. Mine was fitted in May 1988 and it's the best thing I ever did to the car. Absolutely no problems at all (touch wood!) I don't think single points on a V8 engine are a good idea even when new let alone when the system is worn. Because it's a simple optical system, any side wear in the dizzy shaft does not affect the accuracy of the timing.
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Post by eisdielenbiker on Jun 3, 2009 11:44:55 GMT
My luminition is at least 10 yers old too, if not 15. It looks nearly as ancient as the rest of engine bay. Did they change over time ? My MGB failed with a Pertronix Ignitor installed, which had been sold separately before 123ignition installation. Thus electronic parts were not responsible. Mark
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